robertmackayclan

About two decades ago I exchanged information with Alexander Bolling of VA, he being a "white Bolling". He told me then "we have no record of members of our family removed down to NC to settle". That was a polite way of saying "the blue Bollings really do not have any documentation for their claims of Pochontas ancestry."

Personally--I would have rather had him be more firm with what he knew was the truth. Now we have the DNA study which shows for those who can read numbers, the majority of people claiming Pochontas is in their family trees are wrong.

The "F" letter which appear in the set of DNA results come from the book by Todd Bolen. I would not trust the information given by said researchers. Most claim Pochontas ancestory.

I am really only interested in Group Three named after Benj. Bolling b. 1734, d. 1832, his numbers match my oldest known Bowling ancestor John (husband to Elizabeth).

Starting with Reeves Bowling/Bolen b. 1 Dec 1818, d. 1864 his son
John W. Bolen his son
Wm. R. bolen his son
Harold Jean Bolen (family historian) his son
Wm. H. Bolen Kit #3746

I still am looking for documentation to support H.J. Bolen's statements about the siblings of Reeves' in NC, but DNA test are matching the other known son of John & Martha (Mangum) Bowling. The share a common "Y" marker.

Willis Bolling b 1791, d. 1881, two kits #2207 Thomas Benton Bowling and #106892 Phil Bowling.

Joseph Bolling b. 1801, this kit #1947 Franklin Bowling & kit #33587 James Wesley Boulden

So the two kits for Willis, Joseph match the one kit # supplied by descendant of Reeves Bowling/Bolen of Henderson Co. TN.

I was the first Bolling researcher to have found the land deeds of John Bowling in NC made his mark with side ways "B" and his wife Elizabeth with "E". These deeds stated that they removed to York Co. SC and the same marks have been found by researchers in York Co. SC. I made copies of the NC records, but never heard back from them to send their copies. Some day I will get around to ordering those deeds. HOWEVER many Kit # under heading of Benj. Bolling 1734-1832 show the same numbering pattern as the five above.

You can go down the listing I believe well over 15 of his descendants send in sample, which is why I guess Group Three called by his name.

I did notice Kit #23413 list oldest ancestor as Thomas Bouldinge of Swan, that is wrong they have their own group 2. In Todd Bolen's book Fh665

There is also a test kit #93570 links Baxter Bolling with said John & Benjamin Bolling/Bowling

Those who thought our Bolen of Henderson Co. TN might have been descendant of Pochontas are wrong and other theory (before DNA) the other old Bolling Line of VA--Thomas who came over on the "Swan". They too have their own group and we do not belong.

This DNA test shows us going forward from NC we will want to find at least: John, Benj. & Baxter together.

I say MD and other say VA.

Part of my research is to find all Haplogroup found on my pedigree charts, not a easy task.

Thanks to the effort of a distant cousin Guy Derryberry, he found my distant cousin Donald Derryberry who also descends from Thomas Derryberry of Henderson Co. TN who took the DNA test.

You can find the same pattern of numbers on Y-Search under Andy Lynn Derryberry's (line of Adam) numbers the same as Guy Derryberry (line of Michael-- his not public) & Donald Derryberry (line of Thomas his not public).

R1b1a2 13,22,15,10,11,14,12,12,11,13,13,28

You can find the rest of the number on Y-Search

The emigrate ancestor was Hans Michael Torenberger arrived 1738 in the boat "Robert & Oliver" (another source said "Robert & Alice").

One place in PA given as his residence Lehigh Co. PA (formed from Northampton Co. PA in 1812).

I have already viewed tax list for Northampton and I have not found said Hans Michael. I will be ordering film dealing with Philadelphia Co. PA for my Schipp/Ships will see if I can find him in that location.

Hans Michael would have arrived about the same time and perhaps the same location as my John Frederick Schipp.

My grandmother Olive Odillion King was the gr-gr-gr-granddaughter of the Rev. John KING one of three Methodist ministers send to America by John Wesley.

I have two published books dealing with the parentage & early life of John King and some of their information does not match.

The book published by "The Carroll Co. TN Historical Society", done by committee.

"Joel King b. on or about 1710. Well to do, prosperous member of Church of England. His youngest son John King who became first Methodist to preach in Baltimore,MD.

"John King born 1746 in Leicestershire, England, youngest son of Joel King. He studied at Oxford University and London Medical College where he obtained his Medical Degree. While in London he met John Wesley and was converted to Methodism and became a coworker with Wesley, Bishop Ashbury and Pillmore. John King set sail for America in 1769 at the age 23. In 1770 he started preaching in DE, MD, NJ & VA. He was first Methodist to preach in Baltimore, MD. He was one of original council of ten that composted first Methodist conference in America in 1773.

"In December he married Sallie (Sarah) Seawell from a prominent family of Butte Co. NC. They bought a home near Louisburn, Franklin Co. NC and then 1779 moved to Wake Co. NC 10 miles west of Raleigh. He took part in the first Methodist conference of NC. When Franklin Academy was chartered in 1787 he was first named on list of trustee. He died in Wake Co. NC 1795. He was survived by his wife and six children: Joel, John Wesley, Benj., Thomas, Wm. Fletcher & Elizabeth".

No sources are given for where they got the information.

Because I was going on the birth place of John in Leicestershire, I saw that a member of L.D.S. church placed a marriage record for Joel King & Rose Clark in St. John Baptist in Northampton, England. I did find the original record for this marriage L.D.S. fiche 6128581 on the 14th fiche of 26. Bride & groom stated of that parish. Since his county is next to Leicestershire, thought might be the parents of John. Now think this Joel was not the father of my John.

The second book by Ben Lee Seawell "The Genealogy of The Known Descendants of Col. Benj. Seawell & Lucy Hicks".

This book has a picture/painting of Rev. John King, St. George Methodist Episcopal Church of Philadelphia, PA and ink drawning of John preaching in Baltimore, MD.

This book states that John was born in Lancaster, England. Not near the other two locations. This book has some of the same information about his preaching in MD, NJ, VA & NC.

"Where he preached his first sermon from a blacksmith's block at the street corner", this book as a ink drawing of the act.

"He was present at the first Methodist Episcopal Conference ever held in NC on 20th Apr 1785 at the home of his brother-in-law Rev. Green Hill."

This book as well as other published books on Seawell family stated the family from Brunswick Co. VA, not NC.

I have copy of his will and inventory. He was a slave owner.

In short I have two different birth places for John King. I will have to find the actual parish before I can order fiche/film.

I think his wife's family was from Brunswick Co. VA and not NC. I have no idea where each two books got their information. That I will have to find for myself.

You can google "Rev. John King" most likely information will "pop up". Now if correct I have no idea.

I believe a male descend of Rev. John King is included in FamilytreeDNA study for King family.

If I can review the data base in Family Tree DNA for all surnames: first I would see if male McKay who document their line back to MARYLAND, what is their Haplogroup?. I suspect would not match "our" Robert Mackay Sr. Non-matches are just as important as matches.

Just think of all the time people wasting trying to find a link between each other with the same surname. D.N.A. Test (cheaper way to go) could tell them right away not to waste their time and money or there might be a relationship.

I would have to think about your statement about what looking at tests the females would yield me. A Y marker test on the males of Floyd McKay would settle the question.

I would love to see our IN cousins to step up and submit their tests. A lot of the information I have about those cousins was given to the late Hunter Branson McKay and he never questioned what people gave to him or questioned their documentation.

I have been Google various surnames in my personal chart to see if D.N.A. results are posted. All in connectin with Y marker and I have really not seen people studying Mitochondrial D.N.A.

The Bolling Family Association very nice site and there are Bolen whose results show "E" (African-American Marker, "L" for females) and I wonder who they might be. I really would love to see the two sons of my Reeves Bolen to be tested, to see if they matched each other and if they matched the Bolen decendants of John Bowling & Martha Mangum. I am assuming the brothers of my Reeves Bolen were tested.

D.N.A. as totally settled the question of my Ball ancestors as NOT being related to Col. Wm. Ball.

D.N.A. has given me the Haplogroup of President Z. Taylor, now I just have to hope a distant member of my Taylor family submit his test.

The Mangum site I am going to have to study closer to see if they have clearly found the Y Marker for Joseph Mangum, my ancestor.

Found the Gist Y Marker for my ancestor of Christopher Gist of early Baltimore, MD.

There is a Brown D.N.A. Site, but I have not found the time to study it. I have four different Brown Families.

I have looking on line for our Sowers & Kerfoot families, but I have not found any good sites. If you hear anything about these families I would like to know about them.

As I cumulate my various Haplogroups, post the results on my Charts, I can start to narrow down the possiblies of Native American (was only in connection with Bolen Family, so that's settled) or African-American (never spoke of) in my family groups.

If Family Tree D.N.A. would open their records to me I am sure I could find the Haplogroups for all our Quaker ancestors. Send them a e-mail on Friday, just waiting for their answer.

L.D.S. 192633 Bucks Co. PA Church Records:

6 Oct 1810 Daniel Hopgood of Berkeley Co. VA to MARTHA Thatcher of Buckingham TWP of Bucks Co. PA.

In 1991 a member of the L.D.S. church send into their International Genealogical Index, which Genealogy.com has in their data base, that her first name was Mary Ann.

This incorrect informatin has been picked up by various Hopgood researchers who have assigned Daniel Hopgood two wives: Mary Ann and Martha.

Daniel only had one wife Martha Thatcher.

He had with her: Wm. (died 1837), Matilda, George G. (mine line) & Wm. L.

I am also descended from Rev. John King, through his son Benjamin. I would love to correspond more with cousins on this line.

Since the court house of Henderson Co. TN has in the past burned down, all the early records for the people living in the area were lost. Like marriage records, birth or death records, land deeds and will etc.... So "we" have to use whatever we can find.

Some of the names of Elizabeth's children are based on Federal Census or Bible Records which have been collected by researchers in the past, some could be based on oral conversation.

Children of Isaac & Elizabeth (Brown) Morris:

1. Mahala Morris b. c1800 NC, she was living with Elizabeth Morrice (sic) for the 1830, not listed for 1840 census, either married or died without issue. She was included on the listing of children supplied by Delores Holladay.

2. Henry Morris b. 18 May 1805 NC, m-1 28 Jan 1830 Henderson Co. TN China G. Foyster, m-2 29 Dec 1841 in Henderson Co. to Piety Cazort, d. 3 Oct 1851 Henderson Co. TN, buried in Morris Family Cemetery in Henderson Co. TN. I have a picture of his grave marker, bible records dealing with his families found in the works of Jonathan K.T. Smith. Said Delores Holladay was a descendant of this couple. If she had personal knowledge about parentage & siblings of Henry I do not know. Hope that is the case.
He had a son named Felix and a daughter named Amanda, so did Frances L. (Morris) Melton.

3. Zenus Morris b. 1814 NC, m-1...........? m-2 c1838 Dorothy Ann Austin, d. c1859 Henderson Co. TN. I believe I have contacted in the past by researcher of his line. For the latter census I believe one of his daughters living with Benson family. I do not know if this is the only reason believe a relationship with #4 James G. Morris. There is a place for male his age group 1830 census Elizabeth Morrice (sic)

4. James G. Morris b. 1817 NC m. c1842 Mahala Benson, d. c1869 Henderson Co. TN. Delores Holladay had him on her list as son of Elizabeth as James Morris. D.N.A test has been done.

5. Wm. Pitts Morris b. 12 Jan 1817 Sumner Co. TN, m. 2 Jul 1838 Perry Co. TN to Elvira Jane Johnson, d. 22 Apr 1893 Camden Cemetery in Benton Co. TN. His name on the list of Delores Holladay. You will find a lot information about him in the works of Jonathan K.T. Smith. In connection with him is only one piece of information which named his parents as Isaac Morris & Elizabeth Brown as coming into TN for Orange Co. NC. I have not been able to find any record that he directly named any of his siblings. In the works of Jonathan K.T. Smith stated that he personal talked to the family members of said Wm. P. Morris. His works contains a picture of said Wm. P. Morris & his house.

6. George W. Morris b. 1821 TN, m. L.J. Morgan, died by 1870 Henderson Co. TN. He is connected to Elizabeth and his sister Frances L. (Morris) Melton by census information. Delores Holladay did not include him on her listing of children.

7. Frances L. Morris b. 1824 Henderson Co. TN, m. Cornelius Melton, d. 13 Aug 1878 Henderson Co. TN. Connected to Elizabeth (Brown) Morris by 1830,1840,1850, 1860 & 1870 census. Delores Holladay did not include her on her listing of children. This is my blood line, D.N.A. done.

Since Reed Morris has done his D.N.A test any Morris male has been handed a "gold opportunity" , just submit your own sample to see if you match.

If you descend from said Mahala Morris then you could help document the above set of children.

I have the names of other Morrice living in 1830 Henderson Co. TN, if you know if related to Isaac & Elizabeth (Brown) Morris, I would love to know your sources.

Dee Ann,
I am continuing my search to connect John James Morris to James G. Morris to Elizabeth and Isaac Morris but have not made any headway. I believe Robert Reed Morris is following the same line. I am trying to contact him but I don't have a current email. If you have a current email could you share it with me or you could just send him an email with my email address.
thank you for your help,
cathey