robertmackayclan

In 1991 when I compiled my notes about the ancestry of Elizabeth Antrim(wife of Jacob McKay), dealing with her Foster ancestry, I was lacking the maiden name of Josiah Foster's wife Amy. I have been aware for a couple of years, that her maiden name was BORDEN.

Said Amy was the daughter of Benj. & Abigail (Grover) Borden. I plan in the future to collect documents on her Borden & Grover families. There is a lot of information about both in the L.D.S. computer bank (and I am sure all over the net) but I do not know if the information is correct.

The Borden family lived in the town of Headcorn, Kent, England, so at least I will need to look into only one location in GB. According to the information on line

1. Henry Borden b. 1370 in Headcorn, Kent, England
2. Thomas Borden b. 1401-1469 same location
3. John Borden b. 1425-1469
4. Wm. Borden b. 1450-1531
5. Edmund Borden b. 1480-1539
6. Wm. Borden b. 1510-1557
7. Thomas Borden b. 1537-1592
8. Mathew Borden b. 1563-1620
9. Richard Borden b. 1601-1671 emigrate born in Eng, died RI m. Jane Fowle
10. Benj. Borden b.1649-1728 m. Abigail GROVER
11. Amy Borden b. 1684-d.1770 m. Josiah Foster
12. Wm. Foster b.1706-1778 m. Hannah Core
13. Elizabeth Foster b. 1731- m. John Antrim
14. Caleb Antrim m. Sarah Garwood
15. Elizabeth Antrim m. Jacob McKay

Some of the above entries on line have additional dates and spouses names, but some of that information might not be correct. It would be nice if "we" really do have a blood line which goes back to 1370, but I do not know if the above is correct.

With the Grover family the parentage of James Grover has two sets of parents, so I would not trust what is on line.

I will be ordering film dealing with the surnames Borden & Grover, and I already have their wills filed in NJ. I will not be chasing our Borden cousins all over the US.

Google the phase Headcorn, Kent, England--and posted information about the church will be offered.

States that it dates back to 1100 AD, with the present church being re-built in 1350. Apparently, Bordens have been attending the church for the last 600 years.

There are pictures of the church and a link to the generations back into the middle ages.

This is the link from the Cole Family website:

http://www.thecolefamily.com/hobby/headcorn.htm

Here's a link to the rest of the google listings:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=n ... +Church%22

In 1991 when I compiled my notes about the ancestry of Elizabeth Antrim(wife of Jacob McKay), dealing with her Foster ancestry, I was lacking the maiden name of Josiah Foster's wife Amy. I have been aware for a couple of years, that her maiden name was BORDEN.

Said Amy was the daughter of Benj. & Abigail (Grover) Borden. I plan in the future to collect documents on her Borden & Grover families. There is a lot of information about both in the L.D.S. computer bank (and I am sure all over the net) but I do not know if the information is correct.

The Borden family lived in the town of Headcorn, Kent, England, so at least I will need to look into only one location in GB. According to the information on line

1. Henry Borden b. 1370 in Headcorn, Kent, England
2. Thomas Borden b. 1401-1469 same location
3. John Borden b. 1425-1469
4. Wm. Borden b. 1450-1531
5. Edmund Borden b. 1480-1539
6. Wm. Borden b. 1510-1557
7. Thomas Borden b. 1537-1592
8. Mathew Borden b. 1563-1620
9. Richard Borden b. 1601-1671 emigrate born in Eng, died RI m. Jane Fowle
10. Benj. Borden b.1649-1728 m. Abigail GROVER
11. Amy Borden b. 1684-d.1770 m. Josiah Foster
12. Wm. Foster b.1706-1778 m. Hannah Core
13. Elizabeth Foster b. 1731- m. John Antrim
14. Caleb Antrim m. Sarah Garwood
15. Elizabeth Antrim m. Jacob McKay

Some of the above entries on line have additional dates and spouses names, but some of that information might not be correct. It would be nice if "we" really do have a blood line which goes back to 1370, but I do not know if the above is correct.

With the Grover family the parentage of James Grover has two sets of parents, so I would not trust what is on line.

I will be ordering film dealing with the surnames Borden & Grover, and I already have their wills filed in NJ. I will not be chasing our Borden cousins all over the US.

I have checked out some of the information posted on various computer banks and web sites. It would appear a lot of their information is bogus, false or ficitious as to James Grover's birth year (some have 1607 in England or 1620 NY), place (Chesham Bucks, England or NY) and parentage (three sets of different parents).

Someone has connected "our" oldest known James Grover of NY & NJ to a group of early MA started by Thomas Grover of Chesham, Bucks, England.

I am not going to waste my time & postage to write to any of the other researchers, because I have found in the past their answers were not helpful.

The historican John E. Stillman (rather old book) stated that he had no information about the birth place or parentage of James Grover. His book does have documented information about James in NY & NJ, very worth reading. His book as a copy of his will.

We are rather sure he was born in England, but where I have not found a creditable source.

1. James Grover b. c1620 England, m. Rebecca .........?(wife at the time of his will, some people have her maiden name as Chessman, but one researcher stated she had no source for her surname--other than L.D.S computer bank) We know he had five children:

1. James Grover

2. Abigail Grover b. 1654 in Gravesend, Long Island/Kings Co. NY, m. 22 Sep 1670 in Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co. NJ to Benj. Borden, marriage record available, d. 8 Jan 1720 Evesham, Burlingham Co. NJ, this is mine line Grover married Borden, then Foster then Antrim then to McKay.

3. Hannah Grover m-1 Richard Gardner, m-2 Wm. Winter

4. Joseph Grover m. Hannah Lawrence, daughter of Wm. I am not sure if her family members are the same family that turns up later in Frederick Co. VA.

5. Safety Grover (male)

I will be in the future ordering early records of Kings NY and I have already seen his records in NJ.

In 1991 when I compiled my notes about the ancestry of Elizabeth Antrim(wife of Jacob McKay), dealing with her Foster ancestry, I was lacking the maiden name of Josiah Foster's wife Amy. I have been aware for a couple of years, that her maiden name was BORDEN.

Said Amy was the daughter of Benj. & Abigail (Grover) Borden. I plan in the future to collect documents on her Borden & Grover families. There is a lot of information about both in the L.D.S. computer bank (and I am sure all over the net) but I do not know if the information is correct.

The Borden family lived in the town of Headcorn, Kent, England, so at least I will need to look into only one location in GB. According to the information on line

1. Henry Borden b. 1370 in Headcorn, Kent, England
2. Thomas Borden b. 1401-1469 same location
3. John Borden b. 1425-1469
4. Wm. Borden b. 1450-1531
5. Edmund Borden b. 1480-1539
6. Wm. Borden b. 1510-1557
7. Thomas Borden b. 1537-1592
8. Mathew Borden b. 1563-1620
9. Richard Borden b. 1601-1671 emigrate born in Eng, died RI m. Jane Fowle
10. Benj. Borden b.1649-1728 m. Abigail GROVER
11. Amy Borden b. 1684-d.1770 m. Josiah Foster
12. Wm. Foster b.1706-1778 m. Hannah Core
13. Elizabeth Foster b. 1731- m. John Antrim
14. Caleb Antrim m. Sarah Garwood
15. Elizabeth Antrim m. Jacob McKay

Some of the above entries on line have additional dates and spouses names, but some of that information might not be correct. It would be nice if "we" really do have a blood line which goes back to 1370, but I do not know if the above is correct.

With the Grover family the parentage of James Grover has two sets of parents, so I would not trust what is on line.

I will be ordering film dealing with the surnames Borden & Grover, and I already have their wills filed in NJ. I will not be chasing our Borden cousins all over the US.

I have found out that the parish records for Headcorn Church, which our Borden ancestors lived-- records start the year 1560 to 1812.

So the question must be asked how did researchers have the blood line back to Henry Borden born 1370 in Headcorn, Kent Co. England and died same location.

I have order films & fiche which say to have documented our emigrate ancestor Richard Borden's English roots.

According to a librarian who works at the L.D.S. library who deals with English records, thinks that unless your family was a member of royal blood line, the records do not exist to document a family back into the Middle Ages.

So I will just have to wait and see what kind of records each other researchers are using.

This is the link from the Cole Family website:

http://www.thecolefamily.com/hobby/headcorn.htm

Here's a link to the rest of the google listings:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=n ... +Church%22

L.D.S. #0990349 #3 a booklet by Thomas Allen Glenn "English Pedigree of Richard Borden" about 13 pages. It would appear the web page has taken his information word for word. So really so reason to people to spend $5.50 for the film. It might be in the future to have said film on line.

L.D.S. 0858787 #6 Borden of NJ also has the same information found in published works.

One text by John Alexander Kelly "Benjamin Borden" found in Clarke County Historical Assocation.

L.D.S. 1697743 also have a history of the Borden in England to NJ.

In short, there are plenty of good published secondary sources supporting the English ancestry of Richard Borden and no reason to use the information about the family found in computer banks. In fact I have found some errors dealing with the Grover family.

I have checked out some of the information posted on various computer banks and web sites. It would appear a lot of their information is bogus, false or ficitious as to James Grover's birth year (some have 1607 in England or 1620 NY), place (Chesham Bucks, England or NY) and parentage (three sets of different parents).

Someone has connected "our" oldest known James Grover of NY & NJ to a group of early MA started by Thomas Grover of Chesham, Bucks, England.

I am not going to waste my time & postage to write to any of the other researchers, because I have found in the past their answers were not helpful.

The historican John E. Stillman (rather old book) stated that he had no information about the birth place or parentage of James Grover. His book does have documented information about James in NY & NJ, very worth reading. His book as a copy of his will.

We are rather sure he was born in England, but where I have not found a creditable source.

1. James Grover b. c1620 England, m. Rebecca .........?(wife at the time of his will, some people have her maiden name as Chessman, but one researcher stated she had no source for her surname--other than L.D.S computer bank) We know he had five children:

1. James Grover

2. Abigail Grover b. 1654 in Gravesend, Long Island/Kings Co. NY, m. 22 Sep 1670 in Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co. NJ to Benj. Borden, marriage record available, d. 8 Jan 1720 Evesham, Burlingham Co. NJ, this is mine line Grover married Borden, then Foster then Antrim then to McKay.

3. Hannah Grover m-1 Richard Gardner, m-2 Wm. Winter

4. Joseph Grover m. Hannah Lawrence, daughter of Wm. I am not sure if her family members are the same family that turns up later in Frederick Co. VA.

5. Safety Grover (male)

I will be in the future ordering early records of Kings NY and I have already seen his records in NJ.

I have read L.D.S. 103386 #1 History of the Family of Thomas Grover.

The author stated that there were at least five different Grover families in early New England and New York.

The information he had on James Grover who died in 1686 NJ, father of Abigail Grover who married Benj. Borden, was not related to any of the other Grover families.

People have placed the ancestry for James Grover on L.D.S. computer bank, which I rather think is just make up.

The above history, does not give the location of where in GB "our" James Grover lived before NY & MA.

I have checked out some of the information posted on various computer banks and web sites. It would appear a lot of their information is bogus, false or ficitious as to James Grover's birth year (some have 1607 in England or 1620 NY), place (Chesham Bucks, England or NY) and parentage (three sets of different parents).

Someone has connected "our" oldest known James Grover of NY & NJ to a group of early MA started by Thomas Grover of Chesham, Bucks, England.

I am not going to waste my time & postage to write to any of the other researchers, because I have found in the past their answers were not helpful.

The historican John E. Stillman (rather old book) stated that he had no information about the birth place or parentage of James Grover. His book does have documented information about James in NY & NJ, very worth reading. His book as a copy of his will.

We are rather sure he was born in England, but where I have not found a creditable source.

1. James Grover b. c1620 England, m. Rebecca .........?(wife at the time of his will, some people have her maiden name as Chessman, but one researcher stated she had no source for her surname--other than L.D.S computer bank) We know he had five children:

1. James Grover

2. Abigail Grover b. 1654 in Gravesend, Long Island/Kings Co. NY, m. 22 Sep 1670 in Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co. NJ to Benj. Borden, marriage record available, d. 8 Jan 1720 Evesham, Burlingham Co. NJ, this is mine line Grover married Borden, then Foster then Antrim then to McKay.

3. Hannah Grover m-1 Richard Gardner, m-2 Wm. Winter

4. Joseph Grover m. Hannah Lawrence, daughter of Wm. I am not sure if her family members are the same family that turns up later in Frederick Co. VA.

5. Safety Grover (male)

I will be in the future ordering early records of Kings NY and I have already seen his records in NJ.

I looked at two fiche dealing with Cheeeman family today--6048629 the emigrate of the family a Thomas Cheeseman born 1651, baptism record 1 Feb 1651 Kingston Upon Thamas Surry, England, too late for our needs.

61010354 was really about the Pease Family of NJ. No information about the wife of James Grover, Rebecca .......? (was she a Cheeseman?).

The following researchers have placed on line the maiden name of the wife of James Grover as Rebecca Cheeseman, daughter of Wm. Cheeseman & Martha Dorset

Thomas Burgess
Keith & Joyce Cline
Norvan L. Johnson
Sharon Himmer John Kammerman
Harry W. Lantrip
Amber McLeod
Richard Ricks

Now perhaps I will be greatly surprised if anyone of them actually has originial records giving us the true maiden name of James Grover and her parentage.

If there is an answer should be found in early Long Island, NY records. The couple died in NJ.

Researchers Keith & Joyce Cline's have moved, so we will not know if they really had documentation for the information found in their Pedgree Resource File.

I looked at two fiche dealing with Cheeeman family today--6048629 the emigrate of the family a Thomas Cheeseman born 1651, baptism record 1 Feb 1651 Kingston Upon Thamas Surry, England, too late for our needs.

61010354 was really about the Pease Family of NJ. No information about the wife of James Grover, Rebecca .......? (was she a Cheeseman?).

The following researchers have placed on line the maiden name of the wife of James Grover as Rebecca Cheeseman, daughter of Wm. Cheeseman & Martha Dorset

Thomas Burgess
Keith & Joyce Cline
Norvan L. Johnson
Sharon Himmer John Kammerman
Harry W. Lantrip
Amber McLeod
Richard Ricks

Now perhaps I will be greatly surprised if anyone of them actually has originial records giving us the true maiden name of James Grover and her parentage.

If there is an answer should be found in early Long Island, NY records. The couple died in NJ.

From Norvan L. Johnson 22 Oct 2008

"I have no proof that Rebecca's name was Cheeseman"

So he is a dead end.